From the Alvin and Rosalie Sara Check studio.

PBS Kansas presents Empowering Seniors.

Welcome to the Empowering Seniors show.

I'm Katherine Ambrose and today we have a very interesting legacy story.

A hero that's come home to Kansas meets General Michelle Johnson, who's visiting from Colorado.

She's here to support veterans events here in town.

Thank you so much for making time to come on PBS Kansas.

Absolutely.

It's great to be back home and away in Wichita.

We've been away for almost 20 years.

And so what have you noticed about how much Wichita, Kansas has changed since then?

There's an energy, there's a vibe you can get from the downtown.

And also the connection, with the Kansas Aviation Museum and the people on base.

That's really strong.

And it really helps, military families, but it helps communities realize what the military installations bring to them.

They're really part of the world in that way.

So that relationship has gotten so much stronger, I think.

it is kind of interesting that we have this big base here and probably a lot of civilians don't really know what takes place there.

But yeah, the people there are part of our community, their children, their spouses.

Yeah, yeah.

The primary mission out at, and the active duty side in the 22nd Air Refueling Wing is literally in the name.

It's air refueling.

And the tankers there go on world wide missions.

They deploy, the hotspots recently, the Middle East a lot.

They were involved in refueling the B-2 bombers that went over Iran just a few weeks ago.

So they're very much in the world and very much behind the scenes.

But it's part of a national power to be able to project, you know, those bombers around the world, but they can't get there without the tanker gas.

So that's the primary mission.

And there's an active duty wing, but also Air Force Reserve Wing, the nine 31st.

And when I was here as the wing commander in 2002 to 2004, of the active side, the National Guard had B-1 bombers, they transitioned out, which didn't make anybody happy.

And everybody was sorry to see that mission go.

They did tankers for a while, and now it's an intelligence wing.

So they're the world of modern warfare, of cyber and space and joint ness.

Is embodied on the National Guard side as well.

And they really are smart and executed it well, even though I know they've terribly miss having your planes out there.

Well, that's fascinating to know.

All this is happening right here in Kansas.

And we're so lucky to have you come here and visit with us.

Tell us a little bit about the history.

As Wing commander, what that was like for you?

Well, I had, started out flying cargo airplanes, in what's called Air Mobility Command in the Air Force.

The heavy jets with crew, airplanes that fly really long, you know, go to different every continent.

And sometimes it's for medical evacuation and assistance.

Sometimes it's taking the ammunition, sometimes it's, it's people you're taking forces out.

So I spent a lot of the 80s flying around Africa, in the Middle East and South America before jeeps, you know?

So we've dialed up the navigation radios to be able to tune in, to know where were going and then to see that develop into now satellite navigation that's so precise.

But because I had that cargo background when it came to McConnell, I wasn't part of the culture.

They didn't know me.

I was a bit of a stranger because I'd flown other planes, and my husband had actually flown the cargo planes, too.

That's how we met.

And so when I showed up, I felt a bit of a stranger.

And I'm also respectful that when you're on a base and you're in the active duty forces, you're transient.

We're only here for two or 3 or 4 years, but this is your home.

And so how to quickly make a connection with the community and show appreciation and let them know what they're part of in the world was really important.

And we really, bolstered something called an honorary commander program, where local citizens associate themselves with a particular unit out at the base so they can really know them in depth and know the people who are doing these missions because they're they're just good American people out there doing a good job.

But we wear a uniform, so we look a little scary sometimes.

That's really interesting that I wonder if there are volunteer opportunities or how can people get involved or know more if they want.

Well, there's a group called The Friends of McConnell, and they've really reached out.

They used to be part of the Chamber of Commerce, and now they're a 501 C3 on their own.

But friends of McConnell are, are very connected.

I know the mayor is very connected now.

And it's wonderful because in 2002, the then mayor wasn't really that interested in coming out to see us.

So again, that's part of that growth that you can feel.

Because on a personal note, it's really important for people, for Wichita to know what's going on up there.

But but even financially, there's a big economic impact of the people who work here and go to school and go to restaurants and populate the community as well.

And so it's important for the town in terms of dollars.

But I know that the money part doesn't ring as true because it's about the relationships, but it's a fact.

Well, I'm so glad that you're delighted with this new vibe that Kansas has, that Wichita has.

I want you to think back 20 years ago, what was going on in your personal life then?

Well, well, in the world, we were starting operations in, Iraq.

And so it was a really tense time.

But for my husband and me, we had been married, many years, but didn't and made one last heroic effort to have children.

And we thought it would happen before I got here.

But my assignment changed, and I wound up having twins at Wesley Medical Center at the end of 2002.

And my husband, who hit his 20 years in the Air Force the day after I had the boys.

He said that having been an Eagle Scout gone Outward Bound, went to Virginia military Institute, was a flight test engineer, deployed with the Marines and was a pilot.

You said that fully qualified him to be a stay home dad.

So, he's been the glue that held us together.

And, those little Wichita kids are 22 now, and but we I sent him a picture of Wesley Medical Center yesterday and said, you know, birthplace of of our sons.

And I thought that was pretty cool.

So it's a very, very special place.

And even though it was kind of weird for people at the base to have a pregnant wing commander, briefly, it was weird for me, too.

Yeah.

It was temporary.

I had them, they were perfectly healthy.

I was fine, and, it actually helped me connect because it was a very stressful time on military families.

And for them to know that I got it.

If they deployed, they missed seeing their kid grow and had their heads changed shape every week.

And, and, and so they give the report to me and then show me a picture of their kids and know that I cared about that in the and a dark and stormy night.

It's nice to have that trust.

Yeah.

And that connection with the people in your organization.

Well, probably humanized the general healthy babies.

Yeah.

And I have to say, that photo of you with a twin on each hip, people have commented on that and how empowering that is.

So what are some of the comments you've gotten on that photo?

Well, I think, you know, it's some of the younger women and it's a different, a different generation.

And, a lot changed in the course of my lifetime.

I graduate from high school in 1977.

And, and just the doors that were ajar enough that I was competent enough to go through, I'm really grateful for.

And then younger women don't know those times, but they they kind of think I look badass, that I'm in my flight suit holding on to the babies.

But it just shows that human beings are a lot of things.

We're not just one thing.

My husband's a tough, you know, airman warrior in his own right, but loves his kids.

And so he is a great dad to them, and he cooks a lot better than I do.

So that's nice of him.

That's fantastic.

Let's take a moment to meet your husband.

Let's meet John.

John, thanks so much for being on the show.

Thank you.

So I heard Eagle Scout and I was mightily impressed.

So I would say that qualified you to take care of twins, but you have a whole slew of other things on your resume, too.

I do.

I was born into the military.

Dad was Air Force.

And, one thing about being in the military is you get transferred every three, four, or five years.

So I've been all over the United States to all 50 states all over the world.

But, as my wife said, graduated from Virginia military Institute, electrical engineering.

During high school was an Eagle Scout.

Got my pilot's license in high school.

A lot of exposure to the world.

That's just incredible.

What an adventurous life.

Thanks to, I guess, being born into a military family and and following that, it is.

It really is.

And they're used to.

There used to be a TV commercial that said, a career in the military is not just a job.

It's an adventure.

And then you hear another one, the Army one that said, we do more before 9 a.m.

than most people do all day.

Yeah, and being in the military is like that.

It's it's like a racehorse coming out of the starting gate at a racetrack.

You're just going, no matter what your responsibility, what your job is, you're constantly on the go all around the clock.

Yeah, those were great commercials.

And you really have lived it.

You are living it.

And, it just sounds to you that you've met some of the most interesting people.

Yeah.

And I wouldn't have guessed, that that might include my wife.

Yeah, that was a bonus, wasn't it?

Two way bonus.

There.

That was a win win.

Yeah.

And then, getting these twins later in life.

Amazing.

So, what would you like your sons, to think about moving forward through their life and living with some adventure?

We did.

We did have a chance.

Well, but before, we do get to move all around the world.

Michelle was at the white House as a presidential aide.

I went to Japan to do, an exchange tour with the Marine Corps for two years.

So being military, married to military, you are, separate and then put back together.

Separated, put back together.

That's just how it is in the military.

But.

So the boys, we did we did have, an assignment in Belgium at NATO headquarters.

Wow.

And our two children, they loved going to the international school there.

Having classmates from Poland and Norway.

And Spain.

That's the kind of exposure your average, United States, school, child does not get.

Yeah.

So they really liked that.

But what as far as what they want to do, I would encourage them just to be themselves.

What they want to do.

I'm not going to force them to do anything.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Just to have freedom.

You're just empowering them.

Yeah.

Empowering them to have the the best life for them.

Yeah.

And following your own intuition and what great experiences you gave them.

What was it like to be a stay at home dad?

20 years ago.

Okay.

That is.

It's an amazing experience.

I had come up on my 20th year in the Air Force, and, boys were about to be born.

And, like, like my wife said, with everything I've done, it'd be perfect.

Take my flight suit off.

But Michael Keaton, Mr.

Mom overalls on, and I would say it was just like the movie with Michael Keaton and Terry GA.

Just, Mr.. Mom.

Yeah.

That's so phenomenal having them here in Wichita was amazing.

Also, because the community is so set up while Michelle was the commander of McConville Air Force Base, the wing commander.

The community here is so set up.

So much to do for new for young children.

And out at the base, we have, a tight knit, spouses group.

Wives and husbands to to work together with children.

Yeah.

How cool for her to that, that took so much pressure off of her so she could deal with the pressure around the world that she had there.

It did.

And in 2002, there was a lot of that pressure.

As people can remember, the event worldwide events happening at the time.

But yeah.

And I was able to just be a full time parent.

That's wonderful.

Well, what a fabulous story.

And thank you for everything that you've done for our country, for the world, and most importantly, for future generations.

And it was great to hear your empowering story.

Thank you.

And now back to our conversation with Michelle.

So that was so much fun.

What an adventurous life you two have had.

So how is life different today and what are some of your plans moving forward?

What do you look forward to?

Well, I will say, you know, I was in on active duty for 36 years and I had been at the Air Force Academy before, for years before that.

And, but it has been a very eclectic journey.

We were in Europe and I was ahead of the academy and and then I worked in New York for a while, a couple of years with the NBA, and it was kind of a family.

Take a chance.

I think the fact that we've done so many different things keeps us open to saying, let's try it.

Let's see what happens if I work for the NBA and live in Manhattan for a couple years.

But what we found was the boys did not want to go live in the city, and they wanted to stay in their high school marching band in Colorado.

And so we could say, okay, well, we'll come back.

And it's been kind of it's liberating, right, to have choices and things.

And they could the boys could come visit New York and they were band kids, so they didn't want to go to basketball games.

But we went to Broadway musicals, which is great too, right?

Yeah, except for the SpongeBob SquarePants play.

I'm not so sure about that, but you got dragged to that.

They liked it very much at the time, but I think being able to be open and, I didn't want to stop contributing because I know we know things in life.

You cumulate experiences and insights.

You hope.

And so I'm on boards that are not paying boards.

But they're for non-profits or about education, veterans, youth sports.

And, and so I just try to contribute my insights into how things are organized, which is something people may not think about, about military members we don't like March around, and there's some push ups involved and some marching around, but that's the least of your worries as you get more senior it has.

How are the organizations running?

Are the resources applied to our priorities?

Are we setting in the right culture?

And so I try to share, my experience with, with the different groups who are doing good.

They're doing good for society, and it feels good to be part of that.

Wow.

That's an empowering message right there to take your lifetime of wisdom and use it to help organizations and do good in the world and help inspire younger generations.

So let's hear some advice straight from the general thinking about empowering seniors.

And I'm sure you are thinking about your future.

And you have wisdom from everything you've done.

What would you add to this conversation to empower seniors watching at home?

I think for all of us, we we go through life and think, oh, I need to tough this out on my own.

And I think the lessons I've lea we do this together.

It takes some courage sometimes to let go of who we think we are and what 20 or 30 or 40, and let someone help you and ask for help.

And it's not a weakness.

It's it's asking for information to try to learn a new way, or asking about health.

Our health changes.

Everybody's got something.

Everybody's got some something happening to them.

And so we've tried to prepare for that in our military life.

And obviously we're federal employees and not, you know, investment bankers.

But we've diligently saved, we saved, for once and future children and we're glad we got them and, put that away.

So we talked to and we asked for a financial advisor to help us be wise with our funds, as we are over 65, even though we have many advanced academic degrees, it's hard sledding to sort out health care and which organization.

How are we going to do that?

And so again, to ask questions of experts who know whether it's financial knowledge or, or medical knowledge and, and to reach out because there's still things we can learn.

And I will say as a pilot, it may be counterintuitive, but, you know, in the movies they always show like one person's a hero and they do it all by themselves and, you know, oh my gosh, rah rah.

But life doesn't work that way.

And my husband and I both flew on crew airplanes, and, I flew with guys who flew in Vietnam and were really tough guys.

But but the best of them would say when I was helping them in the flight or something, they say instead of saying, don't touch my switches or you shut up.

They said, thank you.

Thanks for telling me that.

You you're just trying to help me, and I'm going to let go and let you help me.

And I tried to be that way as a commander as well, to say, you know, I am pretty smart and I'm capable and I know what we're going to do, but I don't know everything.

And so it's okay.

It's okay to ask.

And, it works in different settings.

I mean, it worked in an airplane when we were in NATO.

Other countries don't have women generals, so it was kind of mind boggling for the other allied, you know, generals to figure out where I came in.

And eventually they figured I'm just a typing American.

And so they could see that I was competent at what I did and we could build a relationship of trust.

But they also there was give and take, you know, whether the Turkish generals showing me how you drink coffee in their culture, which was an amazing gesture of respect, that he asked me to do that.

Our Croatian, general friend realized he was six feet eight, but I was his commander and he came to respect that.

I could do different things than he could do, and we could work together.

But you have to, you know, I had to let go, and they had to let go to get to that.

We to move forward.

That's so, so right in line with what we talk about all the time.

I talk a lot about aging as a team sport, and this is eye opening for me to think about the military aspect of, the team environment and that everyone has their own specialty.

And you've got to gather intelligence, you've got to gather information.

So you know what to do.

People often are really stuck, trying to figure out what to do.

But you've got to start with gathering information, right.

And there's a new way to do it.

And it's one of the blessings of our boys.

Being only 22 right now is that they can kind of guide us through some things, but there's a different way of learning, you know, and sometimes you need to watch YouTube videos and some of I'm pretty good, but some of them aren't good enough.

And to be able to look at and go, I cannot do a DIY, DIY in my house based on that video, I need to have a plumber come here right now.

But but to start the work by learning from the internet.

And I think one of my personal concerns is with the growth of the internet, it should pull it.

It should open our minds to the world.

And but it can close us down.

But if we can open and see, well, what else?

How do they do that?

Is there a way to do that or how does it work in other place?

It gives us some background at least, to be able to have a good question, whether a medical question, right, or how do you know we do your bathroom?

It's all in how you use it, because sometimes people will complain and say, for example, that social media is negative, that it's the algorithm that you create.

So if you're curious and you're looking for good stuff, good stuff is going to find you, right?

And if you go negative, right, that's what you're going to be bombarded with.

Truly.

Yeah.

Like we don't have a very big, social media presence.

I have a little LinkedIn presence just so friends can find me from years ago, but I'm not really active on it.

But it has been a way to connect.

But I don't get caught up in strings of things.

And again, and on YouTube videos.

I love sports, so.

And I love basketball and track and field.

So I'm like the one geek who watches videos of professional track, but that's what it feeds me then.

Or uplifting music.

Yeah, right.

Or things you can learn.

And I'm heartened by our sons who are band kids, and one is the math major at Colorado State right now, and the other one is already started working.

When they come in, they they've learned something and it might be about nature.

It might be about history.

But I hope as parents, we've helped them see the internet as a tool.

Just like AI is going to be a tool, but it shouldn't we shouldn't just give up all of our judgment to this tool.

We should use it and, and not be afraid of it.

And I think that's important for us as we get older, too, because it's different.

It's so different than the Spencer Public Library and Spencer, Iowa, which was my window to the world.

You know, in the, in the 70s.

So, we just have to stay open to that.

Yeah.

So we've seen a lot of change, but maybe even less change than generations behind us.

I don't know that we've survived seeing a lot of change and being open to that is so important.

So and thanks for being open to being on the show, by the way.

Thank you.

Tell us a little bit about what you're doing with, what you are doing or have done with MBA.

So I was I grew up in Iowa and in Iowa, little girls play basketball.

And when I grew up in the 60s and 70s, there was still six player, you know, offense and defense.

And, and I was really good on offense.

And I had a nice jump shot, but this was way before women's basketball was cool.

And, so, I was able to go to the Air Force Academy to have my opportunity to get to higher education.

But I also was a good basketball player, and it was before women were in the NCAA, even we were in Iaw.

But I was an academic All-American, basketball player.

So I can spell basketball.

And and then when I became superintendent of the academy years later, the military service academies have Division one NCAA sports.

So you you have a sense of that side of the business.

And it's a weird dynamic between higher education, military training and in sports at that level.

But I was familiar with it.

So the NBA called me in 2017 and said, would you be the head of our referee operations?

And some people may have been referees or they know them, but other people may think that referees just show up on the day, you know, and are yelled at by everyone, and then that's it.

But they don't.

It's a profession and there's a whole ecosystem of of the referee, profession.

But it hadn't been codified.

They, they had sort of master apprentice training, you know, just trust me.

I know what this looks like.

And you can't do that now with instant replay and cameras on everybody's phone and and gambling, illegal gambling that, you have to make sure everything's fair.

And, so I was able to listen to the expertise of the referees and codify.

How do we train to that?

How do we define terms?

You know, it's the management 101 stuff that that you really learn in military service that people may not think about when you stay around as long as a general does, that's what you spend your time on, is making sure organizations and resources are aligned right.

Fascinating.

So what diversity you've had with your career and you've done so many, so many wonderful things.

And we thank you so much for being here on the empowering Senior Show.

Thanks for having me.

It's good to be in Kansas and thank you for tuning in.

I hope you enjoyed this episode.

And if you have questions about any of the topics that we cover, give us a ring at 316-686-4500 or email us at Empowering Seniors at KPTS.org I'm Katherine Ambrose and I'll see you on the next Empowering Seniors.